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Vista Will Kill You With Security Prompts
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datababe
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 7:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Example picture of prompt

I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed that the program in the Vista deletion example happened to be Firefox. Coincidence? I think not. Wink
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MadameX
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shocked

Well....that does it for me! Wink
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Nick
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The use of Firefox is from the guy who was testing Vista. One of the first things he did was to install Firefox like all good Firefox users would do Smile I don't think it's Firefox being targeted. Any program he installed that put a short cut that he then went to delete would have generated the prompt. If you read more closely, denying the action would leave the shortcut to Firefox. So if someone is confused, it is more likely that the Firefox icon would stay. If it was a case of Firefox being targeted, then MS isn't doing a good job of hiding Firefox. The prompt is alerting you to the fact that the shortcut is being deleted.

Also notice that there is an option to remember the action. If you check the option, presumably you won't be asked again about deleting a Firefox shortcut. Maybe even all short cuts on your desktop.

I am sure that there will be a built in set of rules by the time Vista is released next year that will reduce the number of questions Vista will ask you. I posted this because right now you can see Vista will ask lots of questions when 1st installed and most people will not tolerate that. They will quickly learn to check remember my answer and click allow. When a prompt finally does come for a malware item, people will be so used to checking and allowing, that they will let the malware right on through.

In that scenario, the whole system of asking before allowing changes is pointless because people will let bad things through. At that point, the system is only a hassle for people because of the prompting. That's the point of the blog post I linked to. Even before silajine posted, I figured that the system was going to be changed. No way will people tolerate being asked all these questions to delete short cuts and change their homepage.
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datababe
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know, Nick. I'm just having one of those days where no small scrap of perceived irony escapes my notice. Wink

And here goes my Blackberry again....! Rolling Eyes
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Oldfrog
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I know, Nick. I'm just having one of those days where no small scrap of perceived irony escapes my notice.

Irony can be fun, datababe. If I were doing an illustrated tutorial of the Sunbelt/Kerio firewall I would likely show it disallowing MS processes and network access.
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datababe
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL. We had fun deploying the latest desktop model from $Manufacturer a few months ago. DEP was enabled in the BIOS, and it promptly broke $Big_Financial_App - turned out it was identifying some $B_F_A code as potential malware and blocking it.

More than a few us who support that app, myself included, didn't think that was too far from wrong.
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thejynxed
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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2006 12:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had DEP think that Access and Excel were malware before :)

Then again, who cares about Vista. Microsoft already dropped all of the features that would have made it any more different than XP with updated graphics and nag screens.
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datababe
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 5:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

More on Vista's security features:

http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9000299

I have my own opinions on the Yankee group, but I can't disagree with the "patronizing" observation. Wink
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sleepingbear
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote from the article above:

"Yankee believes Vista's security improvements will reduce the number of Windows vulnerabilities by up to 80% and lessen the impact of those vulnerabilities that continue to appear."

Riiiiight.

From Paul Thurott's site, about Whistler shortly before XP's release:

"As Microsoft likes to point out, Windows XP is its most secure operating system to date, thanks to features like Windows Driver Signing, System Restore, driver rollback, Internet Connection Firewall (ICF), and new privacy features in IE 6. "

http://www.winsupersite.com/faq/whistler.asp

No, wait, maybe it isn't really secure yet. No, no it isn't. We were kidding. Here comes the really, really secure honest and for true version of XP, Service Pack 2!

"Windows XP with SP2 is more secure by default that XP, and more secure than you can make XP without buying third party applications...My advice is to install this release immediately..."

Oh, sorry. You cannot install it now. It's not ready yet. It will be soon, and worth the wait because of all the virus-squelching security!

"XP SP2 was originally due in late 2003. But a spate of Internet-based hacker attacks in summer 2003 changed everything. Recasting XP SP2 as a major security update, Microsoft quietly issued a new road map on its Web site that mentioned a second quarter 2004 date, about 9 months later than originally expected and more than a year and a half since the first XP service pack. Compatibility problems caused by the new security features later caused Microsoft to delay the release until late summer 2004..."

http://www.winsupersite.com/faq/xpsp2.asp

Um, OK. SP2 wasn't the answer. We were fooling you again. The cross-my-heart-and-hope-to-die secure OS is coming! Vista! Just wait! Experts agree, it'll be 80% safer!

Am I the only one who sees a pattern here?
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Nick
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The weakest link is the user. The latest wave of of exploits uses social engineering to get people to install something that they want or think they need. One of the main ways right now is saying that you need to install a video codec to watch something. The "codec" will allow you to see the video but it contains extra stuff that ends up infecting your computer with what has become known as SpyAxe, SpyFalcon, SpywareQuake, and many others.

XP with service pack 2 will give you warnings about installing the codec, but people click on through and install it anyways.
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Gary R
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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 6:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which just goes to show that adding even more nag screens in Vista will not increase security one jot.

Users are so used to cicking through them that they don't even read them anymore.
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EASTER
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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2006 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gary R wrote:
Which just goes to show that adding even more nag screens in Vista will not increase security one jot.

Users are so used to clicking through them that they don't even read them anymore.


Pitiful, about all that can be said for this upcoming venture into Vista (formerly LongHorn)

If there is to be any redeeming grace for M$ programming engineers it would have to be in the graphical area. If they turn out to finally fashion an OS that won't puke and sputter without an end user having to shore it up with myriad Video Cards and a TON of memory or 3rd party support just to stabalize the entire visual side of matters, then at least on this end i would think they made a first step in the way of progress.

Security of course is going to remain the whole different animal it's always been with them.
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